Very interesting! When you described family bullying I founds myself wondering if all the bullies are men, or if women do it, too. I loved the photos showing who was in charge, between Putin and trump. They were a real eye-opener for me. The other thing I find very interesting is how someone who is a bully subjects himself to bullying by others.
Trump is a very weak man. He bully's, threatens, rants and raves to cover up the essential weakness of his character. Unfortunately, we have a large part of our population that is impressed by such behavior. Sad!
trump is a very weak man, and it is really sad that so much of our population likes him. I think they like that he says they should blame others for whatever it is they don't like in life. And blaming others helps them build up (temporarily) their egos, just like it does for trump.
I agree. I wish for bullying to become unfashionable again. It used to be noticeable, now it's everywhere. Elevators, parking lots, shoppers in dressing rooms.
I don't get out that much any more, but it strikes me that when the person in front of you on an airplane chooses to lay their seat back all the way, that might also be a form of bullying. People have gotten a lot less nice since the beginning of the pandemic.
Women can be bullies too. My mom was a bully, doing generational damage. I believe it is a learned behavior, or a reaction to the environment. She was raised by her authoritarian Grandmother, and learned to admire those traits / tactics. Her own mother was my beloved demure grandmother, as was my maternal great-grandmother so she learned these tactics, observing them as a child.
Like we know bullies at their heart are cowards. She died in anguish for all the damage she had done to people, too late to change anything. A hurricane Helene of sorts. One bully can inflict tremendous damage, as they create puppets of fear.
Jan, I can't tell you how impressed I am with your mother recognizing what she did to people. I'm thinking mine might have been a bully, too, always operating out of anger. I think she married and and kids because that's what you're supposed to do, and then us kids were constant triggers reminding her of her childhood. That is something I figured out in my 40s or 50s, after years of working to recover from a lot of abuse. The weirdest thing about my mother is that she somehow believed that her childhood was wonderful, and she ended up retreating more and more into it, finally dying of dementia. Thank you for helping me see better.
Thank you Susan for sharing the concept of triggers....so intragle to abuse / recovery. Also thinking how easily Trump is triggered, and how one person's pathology - if given power is disastrous for all. I equate these types to King Kong on the Empire State Building!
My mom died during the covid lockdown, isolated and the climate of that I think contributed to her keen reflection and regret.
Thank you for sharing, it broadens understanding for me too.
I caught the event at MOMA on line the other night and really got a lot out of all the various perspectives on bullying. My personal interest is police harassment and it was so interesting to see how interconnected this kind of malevolent behavior is. Thanks for alerting us to the event and for your participation in it =] 💙💙💙🌊🌊🌊🏄🏄♂️🌅
Very primal and animalistic —which is appealing to those who resolve conflict and dyspepsia through brutishness instead of intellectual (not to mention compassionate) reasoning. Oh to be such a dishonorable soldier with no pot of gold at the end of the devotional rainbow.
Great article! Will add to my references on this just-published essay - bullies are also dependent on coercive lies, and the chief one here is White Supremacy.
To paraphrase Walt Whitman, “If you stop this day and night with me, shall we possess the origin of all lies?” The foundational lie of America is White Supremacy. It is asserting itself with violent psychological force now. A thoughtful meander, ending with a new creation myth, the origin of stories themselves, and an urgent call for us to forge a new, inclusive story for a better future for all.
White Supremacy, is root. People go defensively berserk if you drop the term into a policy discussion. But they've usually set the stage themselves by degrading on and on, those of color. At some point, you have to drop it in. Elephant-in-the-room-ish.
And as lily-white as I am, because I’m Jewish they don’t consider me white; I tell my now young adult children how what’s happening in our country now constantly makes me feel like I’m living hundreds of years in the future and reading a scholarly textbook on the history of how the USA ended. Because I don’t want to make my 3 kids TOO afraid, I say this with a smile on my face, always reminding them to VOTE Democratic in every election!!!!!!!!!
Were it not horribly unimaginable, it would be interesting to watch bully Putin publicly humiliate bully Trump enough that even the impenetrable Trump takes notice.
The dominance tier you describe going from the home to work to authoritarian government is exactly what I have also witnessed. It is primarily male dominated but there seems to be a corresponding female hierarchy to keep the women in line.
Thank you for this excellent post. I've given a lot of thought to this dynamic, questioning why people allow authoritarians to control their lives. Is it an inheritable trait or something people are taught from infancy?
Rational facts don’t matter as much as the stories people like Vance and Trump spin. Stories elicit emotional responses and facts make people think and question, something authoritarians don't want anyone to do. The stories the leaders tell are all that matters. They make the rules and define right conduct.
I question whether the attraction White Christian Nationalists and Evangelicals have for Trump has something to do with the authoritarianism of monotheism. A jealous god who insists he can condemn people to Hell if they don’t do as he says is the prime authoritarian, and likewise, religious leaders, ordained by their god, also hold that power. How many children raised in authoritarian homes, where father can punish or even exile a child, are raised to fear an all-seeing deity? (the ultimate 1984 Big Brother). How many millions of people have been killed in religious wars, or forced to convert at the edge of a sword, or because of their fear of death by fire? Are people who are raised on these forms of religion more susceptible to bullies and authoritarians? We're seeing a tremendous resurgence in all forms of religious fundamentalism, and it seems bullies find that means to assert their dominance most appealing, since they can claim their god is the final arbiter of justice. Monotheism has a long history of hatred for women. Women have been killed because they don't cover their hair.
I believe it is not inherited, but absorbed through observation of those in their environment. They learn and imprint the tactics on their hearts as their survival, so it is passed down thru observation.
JV Vance debate: A smooth serial liar who asserted his 1st amendment right to lie, complained about being fact checked & is the only VP candidate ever who couldn’t answer who won the last election. Response of the evening to Vance refusing to answer/wanting to “look to the future”: “That was a damning non answer.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDdkauB47i0
A strange era living in. Twilight theme music should be in the background. Just nuts, in a dignified country like ours. How has lying become so popular??
When a sadistic sociopath becomes the hero of 74 million Americans, lying is no longer considered to be lying to them. The lies become the new truth, and the real truth becomes a traitor. Having two truths running parallel to one another causes a societal hellscape, as we have seen.
I had a bully co-worker during the 15 years I worked as an operating room RN. She had management under her thumb. She soured the entire department, no-one wanted to work with her yet management did nothing to stop her. It was very subtle and very poisoning and I read up on bullying tactics to learn how to survive. But IMO, there is not enough information or help for the bully's victims nor enough research into the psychology of the bully. I learned there is only one way to deal with the bully and that is consequences. Strong and exposing consequences.
I once worked for a judge who bullied me for years. What was interesting was that he would never attend events where other judges were. I heard from one of his chief clerks that he was intimidated by these judges because he felt like a small town hayseed when he was around them.
Last night, JD Vance proffered himself as the “reasonable” face of MAGA (no fact checking, please!). I wonder whether, back in the Thirties, Hitler and/or Mussolini needed a similar “beard”?
It’s sort of a shame these remarks didn’t include Netanyahu’s bully dynamic plus all his belligerent gaslighting and intimidation. In the Middle East, at home in Israel, and across the world stage. All while embracing “glorious war”, war as a tactic to obliterate sanity to secure and harden his hold on power.
Bullying, yes, Trump does that. But I think he also grooms, makes his followers feel special and exceptional, before he knocks them down. They come back for more on the hopes that will get a taste of the honey again, it’s what makes them accept the abuse. He’s a master manipulator.
Sounds like a great event at MOMA too!
Excellent speech
Bullies rely on violence. Trump Calls For A Day Of Violence: See What History Tells Us It Might Look Like With This Infographic
https://infogram.com/day-of-political-violence-1hmr6g817zzeo2n
Very interesting! When you described family bullying I founds myself wondering if all the bullies are men, or if women do it, too. I loved the photos showing who was in charge, between Putin and trump. They were a real eye-opener for me. The other thing I find very interesting is how someone who is a bully subjects himself to bullying by others.
Trump is a very weak man. He bully's, threatens, rants and raves to cover up the essential weakness of his character. Unfortunately, we have a large part of our population that is impressed by such behavior. Sad!
trump is a very weak man, and it is really sad that so much of our population likes him. I think they like that he says they should blame others for whatever it is they don't like in life. And blaming others helps them build up (temporarily) their egos, just like it does for trump.
I agree. I wish for bullying to become unfashionable again. It used to be noticeable, now it's everywhere. Elevators, parking lots, shoppers in dressing rooms.
I don't get out that much any more, but it strikes me that when the person in front of you on an airplane chooses to lay their seat back all the way, that might also be a form of bullying. People have gotten a lot less nice since the beginning of the pandemic.
Women can be bullies too. My mom was a bully, doing generational damage. I believe it is a learned behavior, or a reaction to the environment. She was raised by her authoritarian Grandmother, and learned to admire those traits / tactics. Her own mother was my beloved demure grandmother, as was my maternal great-grandmother so she learned these tactics, observing them as a child.
Like we know bullies at their heart are cowards. She died in anguish for all the damage she had done to people, too late to change anything. A hurricane Helene of sorts. One bully can inflict tremendous damage, as they create puppets of fear.
Jan, I can't tell you how impressed I am with your mother recognizing what she did to people. I'm thinking mine might have been a bully, too, always operating out of anger. I think she married and and kids because that's what you're supposed to do, and then us kids were constant triggers reminding her of her childhood. That is something I figured out in my 40s or 50s, after years of working to recover from a lot of abuse. The weirdest thing about my mother is that she somehow believed that her childhood was wonderful, and she ended up retreating more and more into it, finally dying of dementia. Thank you for helping me see better.
Thank you Susan for sharing the concept of triggers....so intragle to abuse / recovery. Also thinking how easily Trump is triggered, and how one person's pathology - if given power is disastrous for all. I equate these types to King Kong on the Empire State Building!
My mom died during the covid lockdown, isolated and the climate of that I think contributed to her keen reflection and regret.
Thank you for sharing, it broadens understanding for me too.
I'm glad we connected, Jan. These forums have become a great place to learn.
I caught the event at MOMA on line the other night and really got a lot out of all the various perspectives on bullying. My personal interest is police harassment and it was so interesting to see how interconnected this kind of malevolent behavior is. Thanks for alerting us to the event and for your participation in it =] 💙💙💙🌊🌊🌊🏄🏄♂️🌅
Very primal and animalistic —which is appealing to those who resolve conflict and dyspepsia through brutishness instead of intellectual (not to mention compassionate) reasoning. Oh to be such a dishonorable soldier with no pot of gold at the end of the devotional rainbow.
Great article! Will add to my references on this just-published essay - bullies are also dependent on coercive lies, and the chief one here is White Supremacy.
MOSF 19.15: TrumpVance and their Proposed Advance of the Plantation of Lies and Weirdness https://eastwindezine.com/mosf-19-15-trumpvance-and-their-proposed-advance-of-the-plantation-of-lies-and-weirdness/
To paraphrase Walt Whitman, “If you stop this day and night with me, shall we possess the origin of all lies?” The foundational lie of America is White Supremacy. It is asserting itself with violent psychological force now. A thoughtful meander, ending with a new creation myth, the origin of stories themselves, and an urgent call for us to forge a new, inclusive story for a better future for all.
White Supremacy, is root. People go defensively berserk if you drop the term into a policy discussion. But they've usually set the stage themselves by degrading on and on, those of color. At some point, you have to drop it in. Elephant-in-the-room-ish.
And as lily-white as I am, because I’m Jewish they don’t consider me white; I tell my now young adult children how what’s happening in our country now constantly makes me feel like I’m living hundreds of years in the future and reading a scholarly textbook on the history of how the USA ended. Because I don’t want to make my 3 kids TOO afraid, I say this with a smile on my face, always reminding them to VOTE Democratic in every election!!!!!!!!!
Were it not horribly unimaginable, it would be interesting to watch bully Putin publicly humiliate bully Trump enough that even the impenetrable Trump takes notice.
The dominance tier you describe going from the home to work to authoritarian government is exactly what I have also witnessed. It is primarily male dominated but there seems to be a corresponding female hierarchy to keep the women in line.
Thank you for this excellent post. I've given a lot of thought to this dynamic, questioning why people allow authoritarians to control their lives. Is it an inheritable trait or something people are taught from infancy?
Rational facts don’t matter as much as the stories people like Vance and Trump spin. Stories elicit emotional responses and facts make people think and question, something authoritarians don't want anyone to do. The stories the leaders tell are all that matters. They make the rules and define right conduct.
I question whether the attraction White Christian Nationalists and Evangelicals have for Trump has something to do with the authoritarianism of monotheism. A jealous god who insists he can condemn people to Hell if they don’t do as he says is the prime authoritarian, and likewise, religious leaders, ordained by their god, also hold that power. How many children raised in authoritarian homes, where father can punish or even exile a child, are raised to fear an all-seeing deity? (the ultimate 1984 Big Brother). How many millions of people have been killed in religious wars, or forced to convert at the edge of a sword, or because of their fear of death by fire? Are people who are raised on these forms of religion more susceptible to bullies and authoritarians? We're seeing a tremendous resurgence in all forms of religious fundamentalism, and it seems bullies find that means to assert their dominance most appealing, since they can claim their god is the final arbiter of justice. Monotheism has a long history of hatred for women. Women have been killed because they don't cover their hair.
One example: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2024/10/eau-claire-tent-revival/680097/
I believe it is not inherited, but absorbed through observation of those in their environment. They learn and imprint the tactics on their hearts as their survival, so it is passed down thru observation.
JV Vance debate: A smooth serial liar who asserted his 1st amendment right to lie, complained about being fact checked & is the only VP candidate ever who couldn’t answer who won the last election. Response of the evening to Vance refusing to answer/wanting to “look to the future”: “That was a damning non answer.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDdkauB47i0
A strange era living in. Twilight theme music should be in the background. Just nuts, in a dignified country like ours. How has lying become so popular??
When a sadistic sociopath becomes the hero of 74 million Americans, lying is no longer considered to be lying to them. The lies become the new truth, and the real truth becomes a traitor. Having two truths running parallel to one another causes a societal hellscape, as we have seen.
I had a bully co-worker during the 15 years I worked as an operating room RN. She had management under her thumb. She soured the entire department, no-one wanted to work with her yet management did nothing to stop her. It was very subtle and very poisoning and I read up on bullying tactics to learn how to survive. But IMO, there is not enough information or help for the bully's victims nor enough research into the psychology of the bully. I learned there is only one way to deal with the bully and that is consequences. Strong and exposing consequences.
I once worked for a judge who bullied me for years. What was interesting was that he would never attend events where other judges were. I heard from one of his chief clerks that he was intimidated by these judges because he felt like a small town hayseed when he was around them.
Excellent insights as usual, Professor ! Thank you for helping us keep clear heads.
Last night, JD Vance proffered himself as the “reasonable” face of MAGA (no fact checking, please!). I wonder whether, back in the Thirties, Hitler and/or Mussolini needed a similar “beard”?
It’s sort of a shame these remarks didn’t include Netanyahu’s bully dynamic plus all his belligerent gaslighting and intimidation. In the Middle East, at home in Israel, and across the world stage. All while embracing “glorious war”, war as a tactic to obliterate sanity to secure and harden his hold on power.
That damn bully is doing his best to make the entire middle east explode into war.
Bullying, yes, Trump does that. But I think he also grooms, makes his followers feel special and exceptional, before he knocks them down. They come back for more on the hopes that will get a taste of the honey again, it’s what makes them accept the abuse. He’s a master manipulator.
Coveted bowling pins.