I was totally taken in by Zsuzsa Hegedus’ resignation, thinking that while she previously supported his autocratic policies, someone at last valued honor, courage and integrity more than a job. I was so wrong. That Republicans are embracing Orban is indeed alarming, along with continually fanning the flames of “fear of the other”. Appreciate your ongoing efforts to alert people to the very real dangers autocrats and authoritarians present to democracy both in the U.S. and abroad.
The embrace of autocrats and their autocratic gaslighting, by some, in this country, and in the world, is deeply disturbing, and alarming. Followers of Orban and the silent adherence to his line of authoritarianism displays an appalling lack of knowledge regarding history, and how autocrats rise to power. The fact that we still have, Trump, or a DeSantis continually “knocking on the door” for total control is frightening and not acceptable.
Agree, in my opinion we have to claim ignorance of history; and humble ourselves and our Fellow Americans --- to wake up, read up, and discuss with each other on the history that is harkening close to shore. Before it is too late. 93 days of work left. May Kansas be our guiding light.
Jan, I’m now reading “Sttongmen” by Dr Ben-Ghiat. Yes, a hard read but to me it’s ESSENTIAL in these times. So much to know about the history and tactics. Because we need to call them out NOW. Discussions of Trump - important!
Remember Kansas. Remember that we have 93 days still. Remember that the Biden Administration had a real good week of achievements that help American families and add to our tax base ( from corporations). Talk everywhere you go. Grateful for Lucid. Sending you positive energy, I know what you mean. When I feel this way, I remember the patriots of the Revolution, how they had to outsmart the British, how it was hard work and the miracle that they won! A ragtag group of farmers against an international power.
Thanks Jan, I truly do appreciate you, all your support and comments throughout the year. You are an exceptional person, with lots of love to share. This site is incredible, as is Ruth. I think, there is a type of love and connection folks have, when we get to write about subjects, such as these. We get to share, in life. I am grateful, for so much. Yes, of course, you are correct. "It ain't ova, till it's ova." Thanks Jan.
Many of us are feeling similarly, sad or outraged, worried certainly, but I don't feel anything is inevitable. As Andrea Chalupa always says on Gaslit Nation, "We have to fight like hell!" for our democracy. And as Ruth says during her Lucid zoom meetings, we cannot give up hope, we must stay positive. I think both of these are important messages (among others). It's a sad reality that Biden has been so discredited ever since Afghanistan. The NTTimes, Washington Post, other outlets, very negative commentary on him nearly every day. He can't seem to get anything right. That is the push from the radical right. He isn't perfect but I think history will show he got a lot right.
Women are enraged over the abortion issue, as well we should be. I am angry that it is so anti-woman in every single way. Whether by rape or incest, whether an ectopic pregnancy or a miscarriage, the stupidity and abject cruelty of the choices handed to women (zero to none) are meant to take women back centuries. I am concerned before long, women will not have the right to vote. I have three grown daughters. Fortunately, one lives abroad. I am deeply concerned for the two who live in the states.
I'm glad Ruth has been given a voice on MSNBC. People need to hear about these Strongmen like Orbàn. I was not aware of the shenanigans of Americans helping him along. Brings to mind Manafort and Stone, Russian operatives working for Trump. The big question at the time was, why wasn't Manafort taking a salary? Nearly laughable now that we know the truth.
Stay positive, everyone! This country belongs to us. I'm not giving up. The gerrymandering is extremely disheartening but I do wonder about the far right and their relatives. There must have been thousands who gave their lives in WWII for the sake of democracy, never imagining for a moment that their children and grandchildren would follow an authoritarian cult.
How can it be made possible to make, or frame Orban to be viewed as toxic also like Putin -- to sway public opinion....especially independents and moderates to view him as a danger to humanity?
"keeping his options open .." = the ability to talk out of both sides of their mouth at the same time. Duplicity. Two-fers. Never a straight arrow.
Their communication 'opportunities' stem from a chess match, or tennis match. They serve a ball, the left responds ( often in a predictable fashion, trying to be honest) -- it's bait that is set. Then they turn the tables.
They strategize far out and then work backwards to achieve their motive. They serve the ball.
Democrats need to learn how to serve the tennis balls also, with strategy. Times are too perilous.
Art I so relate to what you had written. Thank you for your kind words, the Lucid community is incredible, and we share appreciation and gratitude for all Ruth shares with us and contributes to broadly for democracy. We can be grateful for community, and the larger community Ruth brings like tonight with Nina. I guess tonight I remain grateful, active and hopeful for more of our Fellow Americans to share the light. Kindest regards,
I agree with everything you wrote. "We have to fight like hell!" is right. This whole beehive of actions against women has got to stop. This will make for totally miserable existences for men and women, if it chains women into marriages without exits. All will suffer. We really have to educating Fellow Americans. I believe, with the bad hand of cards Biden was handed -- he has done remarkably well with diplomacy, strength in resolve, eloquence and compassion trying to lead us back to the good road and enhance that road we've traveled for 200+ yrs. It is ridiculous he is not given more support. After this week's accomplishments, this should change -- otherwise these outlets have larger issues. I also think all people and seniors should be concerned about Social Security --- no authoritarian would go along with that. Food stamps, Medicare/ Medicaid -- it's all on the ballot. I think that needs amplifying. Those are the hidden targets. Fight like hell.
Kudos for your eye-popping explanation of the MANY links between Orban, Carlson, the GOP, paid U.S. consultants, and GOP/Trump/Orban "stagecraft", hopefully leading their lemmings (followers) into the abyss. The role of White Christian Nationalism is being exposed and needs to be further exposed in my view because it appears to be a major link in GOP "stagecraft". We've seen what evangelicalism can do to people's minds & pocket books. It's a CULT mentality reminiscent of Jim Jones and his Kool-Aid. OUR VOTE IS OUR VOICE. WE MUST SPEAK CLEARLY & LOUDLY.
I've been studying, researching and combing sources to understand the psychology behind the U.S. sway towards authoritarianism for some time, and I've read some good books on the subject. What I've surmised thus far is realizing how much fear is driving alot of authoritarianism so I've been looking at the psychology of fear. In the last few decades, especially the last 2, we've made some significant social, cultural changes: racial, LGBT, etc just to name a few. Combine that with major upheavals in the job market, economics, and then who feels "left behind"; ie. "The Great Replacement" theory, CRT, trans issues, pronoun issues, etc. Combine all that with a major global pandemic, grief, loss, traumas in losing loved ones...it can be terrifying to alot of people. It can be too much to process, & fears get triggered. Fear that many people haven't even acknowledged. In rushes a "strongman".
Sometimes in an age of great upset & upheavals, some people DO WANT someone to "tell them what to do"! Yes, its true. Disinformation and propaganda can flourish in this mess. Many people who are accustomed to being told what to do, how to think, how to act and bristle at the thought of "do your own research". Some like to act as "the authority or the *boss*. and eschew being told what to do. Regardless if one is a controller or succumbing to being controlled, fear drives BOTH of these tendencies.
Combining their own traumas and psychological makeup along with the pathologies exhibited by Trump, they become "trauma-bonded", similar to Stockholm Syndrome.
It's a tangled mess, for sure and I am over simplifying these complex issues as well. But I think its important to address the main, core wound in all this-FEAR. TERROR. And people that are fearful (and some MSM outlets are capitalizing on it) are people that can be manipulated. They will double down on holding onto their conspiracy theories and attachment to "strongmen", even in the face of facts, realities and proof they've been misled. Its a very difficult conundrum. But, we may find an opening with a tad bit more empathy & compassion, perhaps even asking if and what significant events they've experienced in the last few years. Maybe they've lost a loved one to COVID, or a job, or one of their kids identifies as gay or trans. This is hard stuff to experience! Maybe they are facing (or their partner is) prison time for their involvement in Jan. 6th. Its easy to brush them off. Maybe tho, they feel terrified that the world is changing too fast...it is, in some ways and maybe they might appreciate someone listening to them for a bit. If they stray into lies & conspiratorial stuff, it's possible to re-direct them, even if its for 5 more minutes to steer the convo back to their issue.
Again, this might be over simplified and it's not going to completely solve the authoritarian issue, but it might help a little to know they've been *heard* & acknowledged-we all need that at times.
I was totally taken in by Zsuzsa Hegedus’ resignation, thinking that while she previously supported his autocratic policies, someone at last valued honor, courage and integrity more than a job. I was so wrong. That Republicans are embracing Orban is indeed alarming, along with continually fanning the flames of “fear of the other”. Appreciate your ongoing efforts to alert people to the very real dangers autocrats and authoritarians present to democracy both in the U.S. and abroad.
The embrace of autocrats and their autocratic gaslighting, by some, in this country, and in the world, is deeply disturbing, and alarming. Followers of Orban and the silent adherence to his line of authoritarianism displays an appalling lack of knowledge regarding history, and how autocrats rise to power. The fact that we still have, Trump, or a DeSantis continually “knocking on the door” for total control is frightening and not acceptable.
Agree, in my opinion we have to claim ignorance of history; and humble ourselves and our Fellow Americans --- to wake up, read up, and discuss with each other on the history that is harkening close to shore. Before it is too late. 93 days of work left. May Kansas be our guiding light.
Jan, I’m now reading “Sttongmen” by Dr Ben-Ghiat. Yes, a hard read but to me it’s ESSENTIAL in these times. So much to know about the history and tactics. Because we need to call them out NOW. Discussions of Trump - important!
Thanks Ruth. As you folks are talking, I just plain feel so sad. Tonight, I feel like an inevitability. God, I hope I'm wrong.
Remember Kansas. Remember that we have 93 days still. Remember that the Biden Administration had a real good week of achievements that help American families and add to our tax base ( from corporations). Talk everywhere you go. Grateful for Lucid. Sending you positive energy, I know what you mean. When I feel this way, I remember the patriots of the Revolution, how they had to outsmart the British, how it was hard work and the miracle that they won! A ragtag group of farmers against an international power.
Thanks Jan, I truly do appreciate you, all your support and comments throughout the year. You are an exceptional person, with lots of love to share. This site is incredible, as is Ruth. I think, there is a type of love and connection folks have, when we get to write about subjects, such as these. We get to share, in life. I am grateful, for so much. Yes, of course, you are correct. "It ain't ova, till it's ova." Thanks Jan.
Many of us are feeling similarly, sad or outraged, worried certainly, but I don't feel anything is inevitable. As Andrea Chalupa always says on Gaslit Nation, "We have to fight like hell!" for our democracy. And as Ruth says during her Lucid zoom meetings, we cannot give up hope, we must stay positive. I think both of these are important messages (among others). It's a sad reality that Biden has been so discredited ever since Afghanistan. The NTTimes, Washington Post, other outlets, very negative commentary on him nearly every day. He can't seem to get anything right. That is the push from the radical right. He isn't perfect but I think history will show he got a lot right.
Women are enraged over the abortion issue, as well we should be. I am angry that it is so anti-woman in every single way. Whether by rape or incest, whether an ectopic pregnancy or a miscarriage, the stupidity and abject cruelty of the choices handed to women (zero to none) are meant to take women back centuries. I am concerned before long, women will not have the right to vote. I have three grown daughters. Fortunately, one lives abroad. I am deeply concerned for the two who live in the states.
I'm glad Ruth has been given a voice on MSNBC. People need to hear about these Strongmen like Orbàn. I was not aware of the shenanigans of Americans helping him along. Brings to mind Manafort and Stone, Russian operatives working for Trump. The big question at the time was, why wasn't Manafort taking a salary? Nearly laughable now that we know the truth.
Stay positive, everyone! This country belongs to us. I'm not giving up. The gerrymandering is extremely disheartening but I do wonder about the far right and their relatives. There must have been thousands who gave their lives in WWII for the sake of democracy, never imagining for a moment that their children and grandchildren would follow an authoritarian cult.
Thanks Joanna for: this country belongs to us!
Yes, it does Jan. You're welcome.
How can it be made possible to make, or frame Orban to be viewed as toxic also like Putin -- to sway public opinion....especially independents and moderates to view him as a danger to humanity?
"keeping his options open .." = the ability to talk out of both sides of their mouth at the same time. Duplicity. Two-fers. Never a straight arrow.
Their communication 'opportunities' stem from a chess match, or tennis match. They serve a ball, the left responds ( often in a predictable fashion, trying to be honest) -- it's bait that is set. Then they turn the tables.
They strategize far out and then work backwards to achieve their motive. They serve the ball.
Democrats need to learn how to serve the tennis balls also, with strategy. Times are too perilous.
Art I so relate to what you had written. Thank you for your kind words, the Lucid community is incredible, and we share appreciation and gratitude for all Ruth shares with us and contributes to broadly for democracy. We can be grateful for community, and the larger community Ruth brings like tonight with Nina. I guess tonight I remain grateful, active and hopeful for more of our Fellow Americans to share the light. Kindest regards,
I agree with everything you wrote. "We have to fight like hell!" is right. This whole beehive of actions against women has got to stop. This will make for totally miserable existences for men and women, if it chains women into marriages without exits. All will suffer. We really have to educating Fellow Americans. I believe, with the bad hand of cards Biden was handed -- he has done remarkably well with diplomacy, strength in resolve, eloquence and compassion trying to lead us back to the good road and enhance that road we've traveled for 200+ yrs. It is ridiculous he is not given more support. After this week's accomplishments, this should change -- otherwise these outlets have larger issues. I also think all people and seniors should be concerned about Social Security --- no authoritarian would go along with that. Food stamps, Medicare/ Medicaid -- it's all on the ballot. I think that needs amplifying. Those are the hidden targets. Fight like hell.
Kudos for your eye-popping explanation of the MANY links between Orban, Carlson, the GOP, paid U.S. consultants, and GOP/Trump/Orban "stagecraft", hopefully leading their lemmings (followers) into the abyss. The role of White Christian Nationalism is being exposed and needs to be further exposed in my view because it appears to be a major link in GOP "stagecraft". We've seen what evangelicalism can do to people's minds & pocket books. It's a CULT mentality reminiscent of Jim Jones and his Kool-Aid. OUR VOTE IS OUR VOICE. WE MUST SPEAK CLEARLY & LOUDLY.
FYI. There's a typo in the Subject: two 'and'...
Orban: The Savvy Strongman Made in America and and Hungary
there is more than one reason the right do not want the unbiased accurate teaching of history to be taught in American schools
I've been studying, researching and combing sources to understand the psychology behind the U.S. sway towards authoritarianism for some time, and I've read some good books on the subject. What I've surmised thus far is realizing how much fear is driving alot of authoritarianism so I've been looking at the psychology of fear. In the last few decades, especially the last 2, we've made some significant social, cultural changes: racial, LGBT, etc just to name a few. Combine that with major upheavals in the job market, economics, and then who feels "left behind"; ie. "The Great Replacement" theory, CRT, trans issues, pronoun issues, etc. Combine all that with a major global pandemic, grief, loss, traumas in losing loved ones...it can be terrifying to alot of people. It can be too much to process, & fears get triggered. Fear that many people haven't even acknowledged. In rushes a "strongman".
Sometimes in an age of great upset & upheavals, some people DO WANT someone to "tell them what to do"! Yes, its true. Disinformation and propaganda can flourish in this mess. Many people who are accustomed to being told what to do, how to think, how to act and bristle at the thought of "do your own research". Some like to act as "the authority or the *boss*. and eschew being told what to do. Regardless if one is a controller or succumbing to being controlled, fear drives BOTH of these tendencies.
Combining their own traumas and psychological makeup along with the pathologies exhibited by Trump, they become "trauma-bonded", similar to Stockholm Syndrome.
It's a tangled mess, for sure and I am over simplifying these complex issues as well. But I think its important to address the main, core wound in all this-FEAR. TERROR. And people that are fearful (and some MSM outlets are capitalizing on it) are people that can be manipulated. They will double down on holding onto their conspiracy theories and attachment to "strongmen", even in the face of facts, realities and proof they've been misled. Its a very difficult conundrum. But, we may find an opening with a tad bit more empathy & compassion, perhaps even asking if and what significant events they've experienced in the last few years. Maybe they've lost a loved one to COVID, or a job, or one of their kids identifies as gay or trans. This is hard stuff to experience! Maybe they are facing (or their partner is) prison time for their involvement in Jan. 6th. Its easy to brush them off. Maybe tho, they feel terrified that the world is changing too fast...it is, in some ways and maybe they might appreciate someone listening to them for a bit. If they stray into lies & conspiratorial stuff, it's possible to re-direct them, even if its for 5 more minutes to steer the convo back to their issue.
Again, this might be over simplified and it's not going to completely solve the authoritarian issue, but it might help a little to know they've been *heard* & acknowledged-we all need that at times.